American Extremists: "Told so stories"
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Labels: American Extremists
Labels: American Extremists
UPDATE: I want Obama to win. I need Obama to win, but if centrist Democrats keep telling the left to STFU and just vote without addressing their main issues it makes it harder to make them feel "voter entusiasm." That is my main beef. I hate what sold out Republicans have done to America. I want it to stop. My biggest problem is a Democratic party that tells Progressive critics to piss off while the[y] agree with 98% of what Republicans want. I will vote for Obama, make no mistake. Last year I helped raise $30,000 for Democratic candidates. I worked my ass off, and I'm tired of being told to STFU. It's as simple as that. Obama is not my boyfriend, and when I can't criticize an American President because it makes his supporters scared my question is why are Obama's supporters fucking with me and Progressive critics like me instead not Republicans?And this:
I want Obama to win, but not at the cost of everything I ever believed in.Since he's committing to vote for a president (and, presumably, Senate/Congressional candidates) who "agree with 98% of what Republicans want," one wonders what is it that Ministry of Truth believes in? The right to complain about people who don't care what he thinks—and do not and will not support his values?
"It feels good to vote your conscience."This passage is the most baroque:
"It feels good to stick to your principles."
Q: What if some of this criticism does reach Obama's radar and he starts going even more leftist or tries to kick Republican butt? Won't that backfire on us?That is, if Obama were goaded (by all us rightwing operatives, natch, because no actual left/liberal/progressive person could possibly expect anything better than what the Adult-in-Chief is already doing) to do even more good, he would be crossing a line into being an "uppity" "socialist dictator," instead of the rope-a-dope genius who has pushed Oval Office greatness to its perilous max.
A: Nothing would be better! Bring it, O man! We've already managed to inform a big chunk of the electorate that Obama is in truth an angry, racist, America-hating communist. If we can goad him to the point where he stops playing rope-a-dope with us and starts acting like the thuggish, belligerent, socialist dictator we know him to be in reality, we win. We want nothing more than for him to lose his temper and get all pushy and uppity (I love that word!) and uncompromising. Heck, if he gets uppity enough, we might have some traction on an impeachment move. Admittedly, it's frustrating that he has kept his cool no matter what we throw at him. His phony act of being so consistently goddamned adult and steady and reasonable and sober and bipartisan is what has made all our people in comparison look like stubborn, childish, maudlin, jingoistic, perverted, hypocritical, narcissistic, grandstanding, demented, ignorant, freak-show corporatist whores who don't give a shit about America. And they're not. Not at all. Nope. Not all of them. No way, Hozay!
Labels: American Extremists
Progressive bloggers were ahead of the Democratic base in being discontent with the ACA because it was too corporatist and did not go far enough to assure progressive outcomes.
"It's very smart. You don't put boots on the ground. You don't commit trillions of dollars to a war in Iraq," he said. "You do it with the other tools that we have that frankly work much better over the long term because you don't get a lot of public resistance -- drones, special operations forces, use of intelligence agencies. That's exactly what he did."Dean also now embraces the GOP's formerly mocked "kill them there so they don't follow us here" thing:
"The main mission here is to stop them before they get to the United States."Who knew Bush was such a hipster? He was blowing up Middle Easterners before it was cool.
The only military action of the last 20 years I have seriously opposed was the invasion and occupation of Iraq, because it never made any sense. There were no WMDs and thousands of Americans died due to poor leadership from Bush and his crew.
Will the state Attorneys General stand up to Wall St. and the White House?Stand up to the White House as in...?
by David Atkins ("thereisnospoon")
thereisnospoon
yes, of course i will vote for Obama. Because the alternative is worse. anyway, it's not as if my vote for president in California means anything. Cali will go for Obama by 15 points or more anyway.
08/03/2011, 22:16:16
Ooooh! I get it! We have to get the committee to see the error of their reasoning. But just half of them.It's funny how the people behind these "progressive" PACs, whose plans are guaranteed to amount to nothing (other than keeping well-meaning people in the Democratic fold) are the "pragmatists," while those who recognize that neither major party gives a rat's ass about our values and interests are the whack-job fringe.
But, wait, you already said that the committee has already made up its collective mind, and it’s not in our favor, and . . . but . . .
I have been confused by the insistence on the part of many liberal wonks and pundits that speeches and political rhetoric are politically useless and the only thing that ever matters is the application of power....The world surrounding the national man of mystery continues to confound!
Wonks are from Mars, activists are from Venus? Who knows? But I have long been puzzled as to why there was such resistance among some of DC's smartest liberal commentators to what seems to me to be the obvious reality that Presidents have substantial power in their words as well as their actions.
Is this really so mysterious?It's quite inexplicable why the blogosphere's leading lights have such a hard time with obvious truths. Go figure why that could be!
Obama's strong suit is speechification, and since he's rarely if ever used his rhetorical gifts (which I'll admit I'm personally immune to, but he's had them literally fainting in the aisles for years) to advance a progressive agenda, liberal commentators feel compelled to deprecate the power of the presidential pulpit, lest it appear that he's willfully squandering an opportunity to do some good.
Today, 17:40:18
vastleft![]()
It would be nice if there were an explanation of the policy for disappearing certain people's comments.
If I'm being banned after a (cowardly) fashion, what policy have I violated?
...if there's an outcome that you don't like, assuming that the president intended it is a mistake. Instead, you have to look carefully at the particular policy domain, and the particular political context, of the president's specific actions. And you should, in my view, have respect for the complexity of the office and the choices involved. And you should understand that presidents choose all the time to cloak their decisions in whatever rhetoric seems popular -- but that there may not be any relationship between the rhetoric the president uses and the basis for decisions.Also, one shudders at Bernstein's use of the notorious racist term "fairy tale," which he invokes while scrounging up scarecrow-stuffing for his fabrication: that my, or anyone's, beef with Obama is that he's failed to single-handedly fix everything in government:
...fairy tales about the presidency, such as the idea that all policy outcomes should be attributed to the preferences of the man in the Oval Office.My beef with Obama is that he is a conservative asshole who has demonstrated close to zero interest in using his tiny, insignificant, meaningless job for whatever paltry progress is possible from that infinitesimal bullied pulpit.
Labels: American Extremists
I found the impotence "defense" of President Obama strange before, it seems incomprehensible to me now that we need to make an argument for why he should be reelected.
...its central point is accurate: there is a serious, obvious tension between, on the one hand, saying things like this to explain away Obama's failures, and then turning around and announcing that his re-election must be the overarching, supreme priority that outweighs and subordinates all other political concerns, both short- and long-term.
He had Obama pegged far earlier than most others did, as essentially no different in his neoliberal ideology from Bill and Hillary Clinton. Many of us wanted to believe he would be different from Clinton, but Krugman saw it early.
I am encouraging all my friends to boycott OFA until this person is fired, and a public apology is made to Paul Krugman. Dismissing the most active 28% of the progressive base as well as our best and most influential pundit so blithely deserves the strongest possible rebuke.
I and others like me can focus our time and attention on state and local politics. If this is the official view of the Obama campaign, then they can count me out.
thereisnospoonyes, of course i will vote for Obama. Because the alternative is worse. anyway, it's not as if my vote for president in California means anything. Cali will go for Obama by 15 points or more anyway.08/03/2011, 22:16:16
Hi, Marta!
David Atkins says you've "reached [your] breaking point" with the Obama administration and/or OFA.
Does that mean that you won't vote for Obama's re-election, and that you'll instead push for a primary challenge and--in the event that a suitable progressive alternative isn't nominated--you'll vote for a third-party candidate? Or is it just that you have had your fill of the OFA organization itself?
If you have in fact reached the point of breaking ties with Obama, I'd be happy to send you one of these with my compliments: http://www.2L4O.com
I write this in earnest, because there's a lot of what I term "shallow end" dissent with Obama on the left, sternly worded disappointment that typically stops short of an action plan to see him replaced with an actual left/liberal/progressive.
Please do advise as to where you stand on this.
Marta and I had a pleasant conversation at her blog (thanks, in part, to the miracle of not deleting challenging questions).
She made it quite clear that she intends to vote for Obama and wants to dissuade people from pushing for a primary or third-party challenge. That's all, of course, her right to do and say.
But how can you characterize such a position as "reaching her breaking point"?
Today, 7:23:30 PM EDT – Reply – Delete
Labels: American Extremists
David Atkins (thereisnospoon), on August 12, 2011 at 11:21 pm said:Well, that clarifies it:
Spoon here. I don’t have the power to delete comments at Hullabaloo. Sorry to spoil your conspiracy theories. Seems you must have pissed off someone…higher on the chain.
vastleft
"At what point does this relentless pursuit of non-Democratic voters at the expense of the base become electorally self-defeating?"
At what point does continuing to support Democrats--who almost fully reject the left's values and interests--become ethically unacceptable for A-list progressive bloggers ?
Today, 16:38:02
Enemies: Don’t let Obama’s disappointments conceal the perils of not supporting the President.
I know a magician never reveals his secrets and all, but maybe just this once?Update: As myiq2xu notes in comments here, my comment has been disappeared from Hullabaloo.
Is this deliberate sleight-of-hand, or are you actually incapable of remembering that the Democrats--and in particular Obama--are full co-conspirators in our crappy governance?
Or do you have some other explanation for why you persist the fiction that the donkey party has any inclination to drive the ball in the opposite direction from where the elephants are taking it?
Today, 11:58:40
Nicely played, thereisnospoon.
Since there's no legitimate justification for your persisting the fiction of a meaningful difference between the two big parties, deleting my comment was the savvy way out.
Meet the new Village, same as the old Village.
Today, 16:37:28
Obama: We can save housing market if the rich buy foreclosed houses and rent them out.Of course, it will be an even better policy if the rich barely have to pay for those foreclosed houses. I have the greatest confidence that the Obama administration is working on that as I type.
The real problem for our country is not the short-term debt. We can deal with that. It's the long-term debt. It's the structural debt of Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid measured against the demographics of our nation.No, seriously, who needs Democrats? Other than the military-financial complex, that is.
Like most Americans, at this point, I have no idea what Barack Obama — and by extension the party he leads — believes on virtually any issue.Arthur poses questions an inquiring mind could ask itself to sort out why it's so easily and conveniently blocked from accepting the simple truth about Obama: he's not a mystery, he's "the perfect embodiment of the system as it now exists."
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Labels: Blogosphere, Category error
Labels: 2L4O

Labels: American Extremists